Sunday, September 23, 2007

Sweeten's MC's

I thought I would post the MC's online this time. Several reasons go into this, but the foremost reason is immediacy, which is one of the reasons I started this blog, to remove obstacles from creating a better back and forth between members. That, and I've got an axe to grind with some things. Let's have fun, shall we?

Cover: Very cool. You know, if there is one thing that has been upgraded to the point of near perfection over the years, it's been the covers. I can still recall the embarrassment in Seth's voice before he sent me a copy of issue #14 for use in compiling Pulpy nominations. The cover merely read "Pulp Legacy May/June (or some such) #14". That's it, no artwork, no nothing. We've come a long way baby!

EIC notes: After Arnett's and Zaric's tenure, I'm relieved to see that Seth can take a break and not have everything fall to pieces. Not that I thought they would, but you always worry when the driving force behind the anthology for so many years suddenly hands the reins to someone else. You two have done a masterful job. Marlan has some big shoes to fill.

Savitski: (I'm going to include both of his features with this one) It's good to see you back, man. I was worried that you had disappeared into the abyss like so many others. I still love watching the original Highlander. Of course, you have to suspend the disbelief with that movie a bit (more for some of the special effects, especially at the end) but the storyline simply kicks ass (Sean Connery too!) I stopped watching the Highlander movies after the third one but I might give Highlander: The Source a try after your review, if only to fill the midnight hours when the kids get up.
The Yankees are coming through again! Write them off at your peril! And you are exactly right in that they are one of the more inconsistent teams in the MLB, let alone the AL. Especially considering their roster payroll could fund most third world countries. But, as I said previously, it all comes back to the pitching, which the Yanks finally seem to have rolling. Bring on the post season! (by the by, when are we going to see a 'zine out of you? You have great chops)

True Journal Comics: I've never been into web based comics (or comix or khammeqz or what the hell ever we're calling them these days). My argument against them is the same one I have against taking PL completely digital. I like to hold what I'm reading in my hands. Touch it, feel it, caress it like a comely women (yeah, that's a bit perverse...I didn't say I wanted to have sex with it). For me, there will always be a link between reading and having something tangible in my hands. Which is why I still buy a newspaper, even though I read, on average, 5 to 6 news websites daily.

Johnston: Welcome aboard. I'm not sure who recruited you (I know it wasn't me and it's supposed to be my job but I ain't bitchin') but you've definitely got the goods. I just might put some of your organizational concepts to good use (I'm always losing track of things).

Roemmele: Another new member. I'm assuming that Will brought you on board (and congrats to him for doing it). I find it a bit interesting that the two members we have that are confessed "free spirits" both wind up in Southeast Asia. What is it about that place? Anyhoo, welcome aboard!

Arnett: Find your niche, man. I am inspired by the fact that you refuse to let go of your passion for creative writing even when the door doesn't open far enough to be slammed in your face. I know that I have aborted my attempts at cracking the comics world for the moment, but it's nice to see that you still keep trying..

Heitmeyer: One day, you and I will sit down to a long conversation about the evils of being a Sooner fan. It's my mission to help you see the light. Hopefully, this marks your return (for good) to these pages. You have some very stunning visuals. And we are top heavy with prose writers (I can't draw more than a stick figure, a bad one even at that). Plus, I get a good laugh out of your stuff (in a good way).

Baxter: Have you seen Sicko? It didn't make it to conservative Enid, but I'll be first in line to rent it at the local video store (I don't do Netflix). The American health care system is on life support right now and I firmly believe the next president will be elected on the strength of their health care reform policies (I also believe they won't be Republican, but that's a different debate).

Sweeten: Hey, it's me! Sorry 'bout the pinup. If you are that interested in seeing it, let me know and I'll email it to you (if you are REALLY interested, I have about 75 shots that didn't make it...this girl likes to take off her clothes)

Jones: The Con that didn't happen. Man, am I kicking myself for missing this one. But you know why (if the rest of you don't know, it's a bit personal and I'm not going to go into it) and thanks for not cursing my name to whatever God you pray to (at least not to my face) for having to bail at almost the last minute. You do raise some valid points with the "why can't comics get published on time" argument. However, I wouldn't have used a traditional newstand magazine as your counter argument. For one, there are a staff of dozens working on these mags, with an equal, if not greater, amount of freelancers and staff writers to fill up the pages. With most comics, it's 3 people on the creative side (writer, artist, inker) to turn in the pages. If one link falls, there isn't much time to get another. Which leads to my next point. Most artists that I've read about over that past few years (Jae Lee being a notable exception) have stated that they can only churn out a good quality page a day, sometimes two pages. That's awfully slow. How long does it take you to type up a feature length article? Surely not 3 weeks (I'm using the equation of 1 page = 1 day, 22 pages = 22 days). Let's say that you're the artist on Zap-man. Let's say you get sick, or your kids get sick or whatever. A few days off and you're behind. So you can phone it in and be on time, in which case comic book geeks everywhere will be screaming for your head because "this wasn't your best work" or you can take the time to turn in quality work and be late (in which case, they will prolly still be screaming for your head but for different reasons). 52 was closer to your counter argument in that a larger number of people had their hands in the pot to get it done (and I think they had that thing mapped out like a year in advance). With all of that said, however, you are right in that there has been an increasing acceptance of fandom with late issues, most notably The Ultimates and All Star Batman and Robin (that thing comes out quarterly at best and its supposed to be bi-monthly). The only way to make a change (beyond storming the offices of DC and Marvel) is to stop buying chronically late books and telling the editors why you aren't buying these books.

Zaric: I've had similar PC problems myself. I think the desktop computer industry is in collusion to purposefully make their PC's expire after 5 years or so (although my last one made it ten years). I've always wondered what happens to all those old PC's. And then a friend of mine showed me his set up: He bought a bunch of used PC's for pennies on the dollar and ran them parallel (He linked them together to combine their computing power for the non-geeks out there). The overall computing power wasn't "Oh my God" impressive, but considering that he spent less than $600 on the whole thing (including a kick ass 22 inch widescreen monitor), it was a hell of a deal. You know, I don't know why you are so vehement against Transformers. Did you not play with them as a kid (okay, teenager...okay, twenty-something...how old are you again)? Sure the movie had it's weak points, but I found it far and away a much better movie than Spiderman 3. I'll take Jon Turturro's hamming it up over Tobey Maguire's jazz hands any day of the week.

Harris: Ah, and now we come to it. I'm generally one to let comments slide, but I really do feel that I must address some things Marlan has said. Before you think I'm attacking him, let me clear the record by stating that I love Marlan to death. He's unique, sometimes witty, and never afraid to voice his own opinion, even if it is the proverbial "lone voice in the woods". With that said, (to quote Robert Jordan before he died) "I'm feeling viperish today".

"Man, you need to stop giving opinions about music because every time you say (or type) something, you just keep making yourself look bad and lose any credibility you have (which has already been precious little after you picked STP over GnR)"

Ahem. Why do you listen to the specific music or musicians that you listen to? Because there is something within the words, chords, or whatever that you like, right? A song came over the radio and you found yourself connecting to it in a way that separated it from everything else you heard that day. "Hey," I'm sure you said, "I like these guys." Or whatever. Your own personal tastes, life experiences and alcohol of choice lead you to prefer one group over another and there is nothing wrong with that. Everyone likes something different, it goes without saying. However, what the FUCK gives you the right to lambaste me over my musical preferences? Music, just like most other forms of creative expression, is appealing to each person for their own reasons. You like non-mainstream music (if such a thing still exists) because it appeals to you. My personal preferences are chosen for the same reasons. If I don't care for GnR, that's my opinion. If you think GnR is the best thing since sliced bread, that's yours. In no way does my opinion invalidate yours and vice versa. And since tastes in music are based more on opinion than anything else, what gives you the right to say that my opinion is somehow less worthy than your own? That's elitist and terribly condescending (as well as arrogant and supercilious). Yeah, I said Morrissey sucks, that's my opinion...it doesn't mean you still can't enjoy listening to him (although why in God's name you would is beyond me). You don't like the bands I listen to? That's fine by me, I'm not holding a gun to your head, making you listen to them on repeat. But don't say that because I choose a certain band over another that I do not have any "credibility" when it comes to offering my opinion on which band is good or which band isn't. The same thing applies to comics, art, beer or porn. Which brings me to my next rant...

" The worst is that [Joe Madureira] was a rip-off of all the McFarlane/Lee/Scott Campbell (shudder) imitators at the time...he was still ripping off bad art"

I could reiterate my previous argument here, but I'll try a more...tackful...route. Joe Mad himself has stated that one of his earliest influences was Art Adams, hardly a "clone". While there is an "Adam-sy" quality to some of his line work, the predominant influence comes from Masamune Shirow (Ghost in the Shell) as well as most Japanese Manga in general (take a look at Rogue's hair in the "Age of Apocolypse" storyline for a direct influence). If you go back and look at his earlier work, the artistic "style" that Joe Mad brought to the table was a very "Americanized" manga style, notably speed lines and facial expressions. It wasn't until his later Battle Chasers series that he began to incorporate more Japanese storytelling effects (e.g., beginnings of fight scenes with long horizontal panels where one person would be to the extreme left of the panel and the next panel would stacked directly underneath the previous one with the other combatant to the extreme right). All of the imitators that you are referring to (of which there are several) drew four or five pinups on a page and passed them off as panel progression. Madureira would focus on the storytelling first and foremost. There was never any trouble reading a story he drew and following it from panel to panel and page to page (I make no claims for the writers of said stories, considering that for most of his tenure he was paired with Scott Lobdell).

"That it seemed to take him so long to get any issue out...is just humiliating on the part of comics readers."

I'm sure that you are referring to his Battle Chasers series. After all, the man was on Uncanny for over 3 years and he maybe missed a handful issues. Yes, Battle Chasers was chronically late (actually, it stopped being published around issue 8 I think) and he does have a lot of trust to recoup for that. But to say that he amassed a small body of work is laughable. 30+ issues of work in three years is not small, especially by today's standards (If you want to see laughable, look at Frank Quitely. The man can't draw two consecutive issues to save his sorry ass and yet a goodly number of people hail him as a "good artist").

Okay, that was a lot of venting. I hope Marlan doesn't take it personally but some of these things have been boiling to a crescendo point for some time. This was a really good issue and I hope that we can keep it going.

Travis

11 comments:

Monster Monkey said...

Oh, man I have some major MC's.....oh wait...no, I don't....I have yet to receive my copy of the new issue.
And your goal is to change my Sooner ways? I assume into a OSU fan?
Dude......please. It isn't a long talk at all:
You: So, wanna be a Cowboy fan?
Me: I'd rather be a Jayhawk fan (vomit)

The End

tsweeten said...

you can be any team fan you want...whether you turn into an OSU fan is immaterial to me...I'm just worried about your soul being condemned to eternal damnation if you don't give up your wicked, OU loving ways

Monster Monkey said...

you mean...winning ways?
I mean a good rant now and again from the head coach concerning an article about your thumbsucking QB is funny....but not THAT funny....
(for the record- I disagree with the scrutiny of college athletes, but to be fair they should take away the praise as well..and until they do that....scrutinization nation!!)

tsweeten said...

I mean "getting paid for work not done" ways...or "head basketball coach doesn't give a flip about NCAA recruiting rules" ways...or "We like to run up the score on Cupcake University to showcase our offense" ways...Yeah, Gundy went a bit overboard with castigating The Daily Oklahoman but in the end, he was defending the perception of one of his players...which is no more outrageous than defending your mother's honor or some such

Monster Monkey said...

I like that no matter what you converse, you always justify crazy in your head....and, to you, it makes sense.
God love ya

Jason Arnett said...

Travis, I should be clear that Antony Johnston isn't a new member. I forgot to explain that I had pulled it down from the web just for us to read. It's a reprint here, the paper equivalent of sharing a web link.

So let me get this straight about web comix: you'll read four or five news sites and still buy a paper, but you won't read web comix despite still buying paper versions? If that's the truth, then I don't understand. You might consider moving to some kind of feed aggregator like www.bloglines.com and then you can set up a news folder and a comix folder and it'll be just like reading the paper. Except of course you won't be able to touch and caress it like a comely woman. I imagine you could do that with your screen though, if you really wanted to.

Thanks, btw, for the encouragement on finding my niche. I will, I almost have, and it'll happen. I'll let you all know when I do, too.

Ta!

Jason

Jason Arnett said...

Brad,

Sooners get run over by Buffalos, don't they? Jayhawks might have a chance to fly away if they play like they mean it.

I agree with you on the idea of Cowboys. Blech!

Monster Monkey said...

I was expecting a Colorado comment from Seth, but....ouch!
But, the season isn't over and we weren't the only falls from grace this weekend....

At least I'm not a Mets fan

tsweeten said...

Jason,
I know, I know...I have some weird idiosyncrasies. I do read several news websites (aol news, usa today, msn news, AP.org, etc) but I do so more for the national and international coverage. Our local papers SUCK when it comes to anything other than what happens in Oklahoma. But that's why I read our town newspaper and the Daily Oklahoman (the "state" paper), and the Oklahoma Observer (an independant, well, liberal paper) for the local and state coverage. I've always believed in the idea that an informed populace is a dangerous populace to dictators and tyrants (which is why it's ironic that Dubya has repeated said that he doesn't read the newspaper...if ever there was a tyrant...).
Yes, an argument could be made (rather effectively, actually) that the news is colored by whatever political stripe or agenda the editor and owners believe in (if anyone doesn't believe this, go back and read how the news media swallowed the whole "WMD" and "Saddam and Bin Laden Link" argument hook, line and sinker with nary an argument to the contrary). But this is why I try to read several different news sites, to get a variety of opinions and slants. I also read Time (and other news magazines when I can get to the library) for the same reason. (Which is why, after years of reading about all the crap he's pulled, I'm so vehemently anti-Bush. And historians call FDR a dictator!)
But comix are comics, right? At least to my mind. So if I have a choice of reading the same thing online or holding it my hands, I'll choose my hands. Okay, so there are some web comix that aren't published in print format, but c'mon, I'm unabashedly a superhero geek (and make no apologies for it. And for everyone who likes to chime in with the "mainstream comics are evil, vile, trash, whatever" rhetoric, just a quick reminder: without those mainstream "trash" comics keeping up the public interest in comics, your precious little indie comic would have prolly never seen the light of day). Of all the reviews of web comix I've seen, I've yet to run across anything that interests me as much as Brubaker's Captain America or Whedon's Astonishing X-men. However, just to make sure that I give your side equal weight, I will seek out some web comix. What do you recommend?

mar said...

I said in an e-mail that I was going to reply to Sweeten's online MCs in my zine but I changed my mind. When I got down to think about it, it didn't make much sense to do what I'd originally intended. Sweeten is already replying to the current APA in his mailing comments and then I have to wait to reply to those in my own zine? It seems like it's defeating the purpose. So since he posted his comments here, I am doing the same, posting my comments in reply to his comments. It only seems fair.

And I'd meant to do this a lot sooner, like after I finished reading the last APA, but that time ran late and I wanted to get my own zine and my other MCs done and that ran right into me being busy in my non-APA life (is there such a thing?). But here they are, better late than never (and before I read the new issue of the APA):

Yeah, send me the pinup and the extra pictures. Like for some reason you didn't think to send me that stuff already. What is wrong with you? What is wrong with ME?

I wouldn't sweat missing the convention, man. It was a good time but things come up in life that we have to take care of and there will be other shows and other trips. You were certainly missed (we DID drunk-dial you, right?) but there are other times.

An artist churning out a page a day is "awfully slow"? A lot of comics artists these days would be lucky to get that much! Most comics artists these days would have broken wrists if they tried that pace. Maybe it's unfair to compare them to the Kirbys or the Romita Jr.s or even the artists of yesteryear who were expected to turn in a page a day like their job depended on it (since it did) but to expect artists to keep a monthly pace these days is usually expecting way too much. Don't forget that we're already a generation after the original Image guys who seemed to take as much time on a book as they ever felt like. On the other hand, an artist might honestly need that much time and taking less would mean much less quality in the work. Though in the worst case you might have an artist that takes forever to do a book and also does crappy work, like, say, Joe Madiuera.

Comparing TRANSFORMERS and SPIDER-MAN 3 isn't really fair. It's like comparing crap and poop.

Man, you can listen to whatever music you like, I won't hold it against you. Everyone likes what they like and if that enriches their life then I won't try to stop them. If you find something that gets you through the day and makes you look forward to the next then no one should say speak against it. It's just when someone makes a ridiculous statement that harms their credibility at voicing their opinions to the rest of the world. For example, if someone says that, say, Stone Temple Pilots are better than Guns n' Roses. A statement like that is so ridiculous, you just have to doubt anything else that person says, whether it's about other music or politics or comics or art or whatever. As a critic, you have to be careful what you side with and you have to be aware how others are going to see your criticisms in regards to things you have said. I also now suddenly realize that you could have just been joking, in which case -- hey, you got me! Yeah, no one in their right mind would put STP over GnR. Good times!

And cursing while having a discussion (if that's what you can call this) is terribly impolite.

Also, the next time you have a chance, ask around and see how many people are still listening to Morrissey and how many are listening to STP. Morrissey keeps getting more fans every day and his fanbase keeps growing; you may not like it (though I don't see why you wouldn't, unless your soul was made from rock) but there's something that living, breathing people can relate to in it. STP would have more cred these days if Weiland would have died when he should have (say, in place of Micheal Hutchence). In addition, you must conduct this poll outside of Oklyhoma.

The Most Heartbreaking Moment for Me in Being a Comics Fan (Ongoing): Looking at Art Adams' art and seeing how horribly it's aged. For all the people trying to rip him off, no one has come close but some of his stuff looks as ridiculous as some of the worst artists in the industry. Some of the proportions on his characters are as bad as Liefeld's. Sure, he's a pretty good storyteller (after coming a long way, and when he started to be his best he left comics) and some of the layouts and designs he's done are even better than Perez's but some of it is just cringe-inducing. Maybe I've just outgrown it and I can admit that; my tastes have moved on. But there were times when I would have just died for his art and it's saddening to me that I can't enjoy it nearly as much as I used to and, more often than not anymore, I think it's bad. But maybe I need to look at some of his newer stuff (of what little there is, though "new" I will consider over the last 10 years) and should stop deconstructing the stuff I used to look at so much.

That said, just because someone is ripping off a good artist doesn't mean they're any good. Some of the best artists start out as rip-offs of other artists before they come into their own but I never saw much evolution from "Joe Mad" (since we're all such good friends). And you can get your influences from wherever you like but bad art is still bad art. As for the good storytelling, I read all the issues of BATTLE CHASERS and his X-MEN so I must have missed the good storytelling issues somewhere else. And I saw ULTIMATES 2 (or 3 or whatever it is) #1 and I'll say this: He's still got it! With all those coloring effects obscuring his art, almost covering the basic layouts he did, but not so much that his work doesn't still shine through. Yep, still there -- it's crap!

The difference between "Joe Mad" (since we're all such good friends) and Frank Quitely is that when Quitely has an issue come out, it's actually something worth looking at and it's worth the time it took and the price it costs. The man is a true original and even if his work isn't your preference (though I don't see why it wouldn't be, unless your brain was made from rock), you can't find stuff like his anywhere else. I got no problem waiting for an artist to take their time on an issue if it's worth it and Quitely hasn't disappointed. "Joe Mad" (since we're all such good friends) should have just stayed away from comics. Once you and I end this conversation, no one else will remember him. Maybe if we had stayed quiet, he would have stayed in video games. I blame myself, then.

Your italicizing titles is a detail not lost on me, my friend. Keep up the good work.

Take it personally? Heck no, man. I didn't take offense over anything you said. And I'm more than happy to be your release valve. Vent any time you need to. Hopefully once you got that off your chest you had a clearer mind so you could find some better music and comics! Cheers!

mar said...

Comix are usually comics but comics aren't always comix. I wrote an essay about it, if you want to dig up an APA from last year.

Also, it's clear there isn't a spell-check for these Comments, which is frustrating.